At last. Apple approved Opera's Mini browser for the iPhone overnight, and in in a few hours it's already attracted over 150 reviews. They're not all positive, and not all accurate, but it's an indication of how much interest there is in a better browser. While Safari was the jewel in the crown of the iPhone user interface, it …
"""You do know that typing "site:theregister.co.uk keyword" into google does the same thing, I hope? What's more, the site doesn't need to have any search functionality at all, never mind externally-accessable..."""
Eh, it doesn't do the same thing at all. Using Google to search a page is distinctly not at all the same as using a site's built in search. Not that Google doesn't do it better sometimes, but there is no equivalence. On my desktop Opera install I have shortcut searches to internal / passworded websites that Google cannot index, and I imagine that if I could use Opera on my mobile devices I'd want to do the same.
Plus, typing one letter and then your search term is somewhat better than typing a different one letter (to search Google) then your search term, then the site: keyword, especially on a mobile keyboard.
Sorry, but you can't be looking very hard. I only get GPRS in my office so I tried the BBC news site on Safari and then Opera and Opera blew Safari into the weeds as far as speed of loading the page goes. The Turbo feature is about improving the speed experience on GPRS and 2G (EDGE) networks: Not so much 3G, and WiFi won't improve any at all because the point about a WiFi connection is that you are likely to be connected at 1Mbps or more in most cases (bar some crappy public hotspots) and therefore the compression might actually cause a very small slowdown, although not a noticeable one.
And as for searching a site - well, where to begin? I have opera set up to use 'g' as a shortcut to search google. I could easily set one up such as 'gs' which basically does site:myurl keyword. Yes, you can bookmark searches but if we're into pedantry here (and lets face it - we're discussing search shortcuts on El Reg like true commentards so we definitely are pedants!) but the point of the Opera saved searches is that I can open opera and type in the nescesary string straight away rather than going to a bookmark (or even speed dial) and then typing it into Google and so on. Sure, it save mere seconds but its more about the faff - I can use fewer key and mouse strokes so its easier to do. Each to their own though - some prefer doing it a different and maybe longer way to others.
yes if you have it in standard mode then the full page rendering is illegible but I personally like the mobile view where it puts everything into on column. Instant legibility & scrolls a lot quicker as well.
Works especially well for forums where you're looking at a latest posts list.
As for Google.co.uk, I've just added it to the speed dial page
"Mini also boasts also some very nice user-friendly features absent in Safari, such as saving web pages, searching inside a page, custom searches, and bookmark sync."
Huh? The iPhone and mobile Safari have had bookmark sync since version 1.0 via iTunes, hasn't it? Then later they added over the air syncing via MobileMe, so not sure where Mr. Orlowski got that idea.
I use SkyFire on my Nokia smartphone and find it to be a better browser than Opera Mobile. It's a bit more intuitive and gives an experience closer to full web browsing. I haven't noticed it being any slower than Opera Mobile either.
However, for browsing websites with a mobile version, Opera Mini is very good.
It seems there are, understandably, two divided camps on just how good this first released is.
One the one hand you have a browser with blazing speed and some nice, useful functions that make intensive browsing significantly more pleasant. The speed alone makes it worth having purely as a backup for times of weak signal strength and the bookmark syncing is a god send.
On the other hand, though, the aethetics and ease of use just clearly aren't there yet. Scrolling isn't as smooth, it certainly isn't as sensitive to the actual direction your sliding in and when in doubt tries to lock to the side of a frame yet continue scrolling on the remaining axis.
However, from mine and a few friend's opinions, there are two major dealbreakers. Font and image rendering when zoomed out is appalling and a pinch merely results in a toggle between fully IN and fully OUT. You can't even pinch in a little bit just to see the read the part of the page you really want to zoom in on. This isn't a pleasant, sensitive or intuitive experience at all and in all but the most rare of cases it's this experience that most iPhone users will miss the most. In effect, it's little different to Opera Mini on any other phone which is precisely why Safari is so popular.
Aside from pure speed, everything that makes Safari so good for day to day use on the iPhone is everything that's missing from Opera Mini. Having a bunch of great features and awesome rendering speed is all well and nice in certain circumstances but if actually finding and reading what you want on a web page is in any way less easy or intuitive then it's always going to be in second place.
I sincerely hope they improve upon it, and I'm sure they will. It's a superb first attempt, it's a reasonable alternative and for that alone it should be priased... but there's a little way to go yet before it replaces Safari as my browser of choice.
...but what is the relevance of that? There is nothing wrong with the look and feel of Safari either! It's performance, in my experience, is at least on a par with Android's browser! Opera's first attempt in speed terms is mighty impressive too, faster than *any* mobile browser I've ever used--just needs some UI tweaks on the platform that everyone else here is *actually* discussing...
Many of the complaints exposed here regardin Opera Mini can be extended to Android's default browser. Pinch-to-zoom is lame and not very precise, tap to zoom on a paragraph doesn't work very well and scrolling doesn't run at 60fps. All in all it is a much less pleasant to use browser than mobile Safari. That's why iPhones sell by the bucketload, the details.
Opera Mini doesn't handle the page itself, but relies on a server to do it. So if you don't have a connection to the server it's obviously not going to work.
Are you seriously saying that you expected a browser which requires a remote server to work to use your intranet?
Is that post supposed to be a joke? It's not a serious post, surely?
With the basic tenet of Opera Mini for the iPhone being that it is NOT a web browser, surely it's beyond comprehension that you'd be puzzled as to why you can't browse closed intranets with it?
After all that's been written on The Register and elsewhere over the last few months, I'm absolutely stunned if you don't "get it".
I think the only WTFs are aimed at yourself - where does Goat Jam state he's trying to browse a closed Intranet?? The point is that Opera won't work through a firewall that only permits port 80 outbound traffic. The clue is in the fact that when switching wi-fi off and going to 3G, it works - now tell me how a closed Intranet would be accessible from a 3G network, and then let us all know when you "get it"
Perhaps this is what Opera meant when they referred to Opera Mini as being merely a first step?
If Apple are adamant that they will not allow Flash on the iPhone, and Adobe can't talk to them like two disputing neighbours, and Apple have conceded that Opera Mini is not a browser... then surely it would be a killer feature if Opera added Flash Player to their servers and were able to translate it all into something Opera Mini can display with a reasonable user experience?
And in the same way that none of the technology in Opera Mini was developed specifically for the iPhone, adding Flash support to Opera Mini means any Java capable phone can suddenly use Flash too if you install Opera Mini.
Now doesn't that sound attractive, not to mention innovative and resourceful? I wonder what the future holds...
Yes, as someone who finds my Android 2.1 WebKit browser to be generally on a par with my iPhone Safari browser, I'm puzzled by Andrew's comments. Perhaps his experience is limited to older Android releases.
I also use Opera 5 on the Android, where it has almost the same pros and cons as Andrew described for the iPhone. It certainly has some nice additional features, like speed, Saved Pages, History, and Shortcuts.
Moreover, I find scrolling to be smoother on Android than on the iPhone (perhaps just a faster processor?). Certainly the Android version doesn't exhibit the zoomed-out font and image rendering problems I notice on the iPhone.
However, I really do miss the lack of pinch-to-zoom and continuously variable zoom of the Android and iPhone browsers. Navigating around a web page just isn't as smooth or pleasant an experience as on those two flagship browsers.
Opera Mini can connect using two modes, Socket and HTTP.
By default Opera Mini uses socket to connect (unsure of port number). I have experienced a similar issue and it is resolved simply by going into Settings -> Advanced and either running the network test or changing the protocol from socket to http.
It LOADS pages very quickly, and navigation is fine.
PROBLEM: (BIG problem) USING a page is not viable other than simple HTML links. Drop downs don't work, interactive features don't work, animation doesn't play, and more. It;s a "view it as usefully as you could print it" but thats all. I can not use this as a browser for research or interacting with sites, I can't even COMMENT on most sites with it, and most sites also don't allow the use of logins and other form fields through it.
Guess Opera's boarding party has finally busted its way in. About time.
There is now an Opera Mini folder in Opera Link. This makes it easier to find YouTube links and other crap from checking webmail. If you wish for certain sites to be available on your mobile, please to add them to the Opera Mini folder in your Bookmarks.
Not so certain about Notes; perhaps they also intend an Opera Mini folder for that...? Works fine among my computers.
I suppose it was inevitable that the first country to end Opera's grandslam and see it drop from the number one slot would be the UK.... where it got usurped by a game of Simple Simon!
Register
At last. Apple approved Opera's Mini browser for the iPhone overnight, and in in a few hours it's already attracted over 150 reviews. They're not all positive, and not all accurate, but it's an indication of how much interest there is in a better browser. While Safari was the jewel in the crown of the iPhone user interface, it …
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Nope
"""You do know that typing "site:theregister.co.uk keyword" into google does the same thing, I hope? What's more, the site doesn't need to have any search functionality at all, never mind externally-accessable..."""
Eh, it doesn't do the same thing at all. Using Google to search a page is distinctly not at all the same as using a site's built in search. Not that Google doesn't do it better sometimes, but there is no equivalence. On my desktop Opera install I have shortcut searches to internal / passworded websites that Google cannot index, and I imagine that if I could use Opera on my mobile devices I'd want to do the same.
Plus, typing one letter and then your search term is somewhat better than typing a different one letter (to search Google) then your search term, then the site: keyword, especially on a mobile keyboard.
Clearly you haven't used this feature at all.
@Anonymous Coward - "Close..."
Sorry, but you can't be looking very hard. I only get GPRS in my office so I tried the BBC news site on Safari and then Opera and Opera blew Safari into the weeds as far as speed of loading the page goes. The Turbo feature is about improving the speed experience on GPRS and 2G (EDGE) networks: Not so much 3G, and WiFi won't improve any at all because the point about a WiFi connection is that you are likely to be connected at 1Mbps or more in most cases (bar some crappy public hotspots) and therefore the compression might actually cause a very small slowdown, although not a noticeable one.
And as for searching a site - well, where to begin? I have opera set up to use 'g' as a shortcut to search google. I could easily set one up such as 'gs' which basically does site:myurl keyword. Yes, you can bookmark searches but if we're into pedantry here (and lets face it - we're discussing search shortcuts on El Reg like true commentards so we definitely are pedants!) but the point of the Opera saved searches is that I can open opera and type in the nescesary string straight away rather than going to a bookmark (or even speed dial) and then typing it into Google and so on. Sure, it save mere seconds but its more about the faff - I can use fewer key and mouse strokes so its easier to do. Each to their own though - some prefer doing it a different and maybe longer way to others.
I'm liking it
yes if you have it in standard mode then the full page rendering is illegible but I personally like the mobile view where it puts everything into on column. Instant legibility & scrolls a lot quicker as well.
Works especially well for forums where you're looking at a latest posts list.
As for Google.co.uk, I've just added it to the speed dial page
Safari DOES sync bookmarks!
"Mini also boasts also some very nice user-friendly features absent in Safari, such as saving web pages, searching inside a page, custom searches, and bookmark sync."
Huh? The iPhone and mobile Safari have had bookmark sync since version 1.0 via iTunes, hasn't it? Then later they added over the air syncing via MobileMe, so not sure where Mr. Orlowski got that idea.
SkyFire is better
I use SkyFire on my Nokia smartphone and find it to be a better browser than Opera Mobile. It's a bit more intuitive and gives an experience closer to full web browsing. I haven't noticed it being any slower than Opera Mobile either.
However, for browsing websites with a mobile version, Opera Mini is very good.
Skyfire is pants
Skyfire is atrocious.
The UI sucks. It's ugly. It lags when zooming and panning.
And the so-called Flash capabilities are just a joke. What, a SLIDESHOW? Geez.
Better?
Perhaps you'd like to tell the class where they can download this 'Skyfire' for their iPhones?
Two Camps
It seems there are, understandably, two divided camps on just how good this first released is.
One the one hand you have a browser with blazing speed and some nice, useful functions that make intensive browsing significantly more pleasant. The speed alone makes it worth having purely as a backup for times of weak signal strength and the bookmark syncing is a god send.
On the other hand, though, the aethetics and ease of use just clearly aren't there yet. Scrolling isn't as smooth, it certainly isn't as sensitive to the actual direction your sliding in and when in doubt tries to lock to the side of a frame yet continue scrolling on the remaining axis.
However, from mine and a few friend's opinions, there are two major dealbreakers. Font and image rendering when zoomed out is appalling and a pinch merely results in a toggle between fully IN and fully OUT. You can't even pinch in a little bit just to see the read the part of the page you really want to zoom in on. This isn't a pleasant, sensitive or intuitive experience at all and in all but the most rare of cases it's this experience that most iPhone users will miss the most. In effect, it's little different to Opera Mini on any other phone which is precisely why Safari is so popular.
Aside from pure speed, everything that makes Safari so good for day to day use on the iPhone is everything that's missing from Opera Mini. Having a bunch of great features and awesome rendering speed is all well and nice in certain circumstances but if actually finding and reading what you want on a web page is in any way less easy or intuitive then it's always going to be in second place.
I sincerely hope they improve upon it, and I'm sure they will. It's a superb first attempt, it's a reasonable alternative and for that alone it should be priased... but there's a little way to go yet before it replaces Safari as my browser of choice.
Android browser
nothing wrong with its "feel" or anything else for that matter.
I'm sorry...
...but what is the relevance of that? There is nothing wrong with the look and feel of Safari either! It's performance, in my experience, is at least on a par with Android's browser! Opera's first attempt in speed terms is mighty impressive too, faster than *any* mobile browser I've ever used--just needs some UI tweaks on the platform that everyone else here is *actually* discussing...
Re: Android Browser
Many of the complaints exposed here regardin Opera Mini can be extended to Android's default browser. Pinch-to-zoom is lame and not very precise, tap to zoom on a paragraph doesn't work very well and scrolling doesn't run at 60fps. All in all it is a much less pleasant to use browser than mobile Safari. That's why iPhones sell by the bucketload, the details.
Epic Fail
Opera Mini apparently doesn't use port 80.
This means that it doesn't work on wifi networks that are firewalled. Like almost all corporate networks.
It just sits there with the loading animation going round and round until I turn off wi-fi (and go outside to get a signal) therefore switching to 3G.
What a joke.
Epic Fail on your part
The epic fail here is on your part.
Opera Mini doesn't handle the page itself, but relies on a server to do it. So if you don't have a connection to the server it's obviously not going to work.
Are you seriously saying that you expected a browser which requires a remote server to work to use your intranet?
Humor?
Is that post supposed to be a joke? It's not a serious post, surely?
With the basic tenet of Opera Mini for the iPhone being that it is NOT a web browser, surely it's beyond comprehension that you'd be puzzled as to why you can't browse closed intranets with it?
After all that's been written on The Register and elsewhere over the last few months, I'm absolutely stunned if you don't "get it".
Wi-Fi use is fine...
Settings -> Advanced -> Protocol -> HTML
@ Anonymous cowards
I think the only WTFs are aimed at yourself - where does Goat Jam state he's trying to browse a closed Intranet?? The point is that Opera won't work through a firewall that only permits port 80 outbound traffic. The clue is in the fact that when switching wi-fi off and going to 3G, it works - now tell me how a closed Intranet would be accessible from a 3G network, and then let us all know when you "get it"
Flash?
What is to stop Flash getting onto the iPhone with this? Skyfire does it on Windows Mobile and appears to work on a similar principle.
Flash on the iPhone
Perhaps this is what Opera meant when they referred to Opera Mini as being merely a first step?
If Apple are adamant that they will not allow Flash on the iPhone, and Adobe can't talk to them like two disputing neighbours, and Apple have conceded that Opera Mini is not a browser... then surely it would be a killer feature if Opera added Flash Player to their servers and were able to translate it all into something Opera Mini can display with a reasonable user experience?
And in the same way that none of the technology in Opera Mini was developed specifically for the iPhone, adding Flash support to Opera Mini means any Java capable phone can suddenly use Flash too if you install Opera Mini.
Now doesn't that sound attractive, not to mention innovative and resourceful? I wonder what the future holds...
Andrew has a Cupcake?
Yes, as someone who finds my Android 2.1 WebKit browser to be generally on a par with my iPhone Safari browser, I'm puzzled by Andrew's comments. Perhaps his experience is limited to older Android releases.
I also use Opera 5 on the Android, where it has almost the same pros and cons as Andrew described for the iPhone. It certainly has some nice additional features, like speed, Saved Pages, History, and Shortcuts.
Moreover, I find scrolling to be smoother on Android than on the iPhone (perhaps just a faster processor?). Certainly the Android version doesn't exhibit the zoomed-out font and image rendering problems I notice on the iPhone.
However, I really do miss the lack of pinch-to-zoom and continuously variable zoom of the Android and iPhone browsers. Navigating around a web page just isn't as smooth or pleasant an experience as on those two flagship browsers.
Guesstimate my shiny behind
Dear author,
Either you "guess" or you "estimate". These are perfectly serviceable, unambiguous words, and there is no need to mangle them into an ugly mess.
Thank you,
Your friendly neighbourhood word police
Guesstimate
A guess is what people do when they pick their lottery numbers. Estimate is what people do when they buy enough paint for their walls.
Guesstimate is what a woman does when she reverses into a parking space.
guess-ti-mate. Noun or transitive verb.
an estimate usually made without adequate information
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/guesstimate
Or, if you insist on proper British english,
an estimate based on a mixture of guesswork and calculation.
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/guesstimate?view=uk
Fast?!
Did their servers die?
I just downloaded Opera on my iPod touch (hence WiFi is working and strong) and it will not load any page when you open it, just busy cursor.
Too successful?!
@Goat Jam
Opera Mini can connect using two modes, Socket and HTTP.
By default Opera Mini uses socket to connect (unsure of port number). I have experienced a similar issue and it is resolved simply by going into Settings -> Advanced and either running the network test or changing the protocol from socket to http.
Opera won't work
First app that's ever failed on my iTelephone. It just doesn't finish loading :(
Not for me...
Is it fast? yes, BLAZING fast.
It LOADS pages very quickly, and navigation is fine.
PROBLEM: (BIG problem) USING a page is not viable other than simple HTML links. Drop downs don't work, interactive features don't work, animation doesn't play, and more. It;s a "view it as usefully as you could print it" but thats all. I can not use this as a browser for research or interacting with sites, I can't even COMMENT on most sites with it, and most sites also don't allow the use of logins and other form fields through it.
Its useless.
Grapple and PULL ye louts!
Guess Opera's boarding party has finally busted its way in. About time.
There is now an Opera Mini folder in Opera Link. This makes it easier to find YouTube links and other crap from checking webmail. If you wish for certain sites to be available on your mobile, please to add them to the Opera Mini folder in your Bookmarks.
Not so certain about Notes; perhaps they also intend an Opera Mini folder for that...? Works fine among my computers.
Total Opera Dominance...
http://files.myopera.com/haavard/albums/747255/itunes_topcharts_2010-04-14_medium.png
http://www.apple.com/euro/itunes/charts/apps/top10appstorefree.html
Typical Brits
I suppose it was inevitable that the first country to end Opera's grandslam and see it drop from the number one slot would be the UK.... where it got usurped by a game of Simple Simon!
Sounds like something from a Douglas Adams novel.
2/10
It's always nice to have an alternative but that's about it for me !
- Fail to Start sometimes
- Not noticeably faster here in Luxembourg 3G
- Does not work with the WIFI Spots authentications
- Is not recognized as Iphone so a lot of site you get the wrong version ...
- Even if faster, I really hate that ALL that I visit/Type is passing by Opera Server !! Do you trust them ?
Cheers Miles
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