Apple has removed the iPhone 4 and 3Gs from its stores in Germany, almost certainly in response to Motorola's December action rather than today's patent win.
But today's German court victory for Motorola is probably more important: it covers Apple's iCloud service and – by extension – any device which uses it. Apple will be …
... but that's not really what this fight is about, it's more about showing your feathers and seeing who can piss the highest and in this instance Apple lost.
This fight should get more interesting now that both sides have drawn blood.
OK, now both sides have 'won' a round or two... Can they all just get back to making new innovative products and competing in the market instead of the courts now?
Oh sweet Jesus, I'm an Android fanbois through and through (though previously owned original iPhone and 3G), and your comment even makes me cringe with it's stupidity.
I have to stop reading it - I'm embarrassed for you.
I have a blackberry, and an Ipad2 . the blackberry has Push emails. The Ipad, no matter how you configure the damn thing, only gets emails when you access something that uses Icloud, (Calendar, contacts etc). I don't call that push mail, are Apple letting Samsung run with the bait?
It's not football teams. You're not helping anyone. "Android FTW"? Are you 12?
I would like Apple to cease their anticompetitive legal practices. I would like to see more products competing in the smartphone arena in order to produce better value for consumers. That doesn't make some kind of Holy War or spectator sport, you knob.
Mike - you and Barry Shitpeas should get together. The sheer concentration of mouth-frothing vitriol could reach critical mass, which would be amusing viewing.
He who lives and all that. Trouble is that they've taken a kicking from Motorola/Google and they previously took a kicking trying to give Samsung a kicking.
How long is it going to be before either the patent system gets revised or the big tech companies call some sort of truce. This stuff really isn't doing any of them any good.
Apple seem to have a unique interpretation of the patent system. They seem to think that because a patent exists the patent owner is forced to license it to all comers. This is not the case nor has it ever been the case. Apple's argument gets even stranger when they say that since Motorola unilaterally declared the patent to be an industry standard that somehow means Apple are forced to use it.
It seems that in this Apple's argument is that if somebody else develops something clever that Apple wants to used then they must be forced to license that patent to Apple on terms that suit Apple. Which is strange because they also seem to argue frequently that if Apple develops something clever (or indeed stupid) that anybody else wants to use (even if they had it before Apple) then Apple have the right to stop them from using it. Seems Apple thinks that patents are a one way street that runs straight to Cupertino.
I thought maybe when bonkers Jobs popped his clogs Apple would stop talking so much shite. It seems however that they are talking more shite than ever.
I suspect that it will be only a few days before Motorola gets this decision reversed.
They *are* entitled to think a patent is forced to be licenced, *if* that patent comes under FRAND. Also, if that patented tech becomes part of an industry 'standard' (eg 3G) - however that's defined - then yes, if they have adopt that standard to comply with 99.9% of a chosen market, they then have to pay the FRAND licence.
Where recent complexities come in is the interpretation of "fair and reasonable" rates under FRAND; Apple have been claiming it's unfair to be charged 2-3x the price of other licencee's for the same patent licence.
If this scenario was played out down the petrol station - if it was the only petrol station in town - and you were charged 2-3x the price for a litre than the next guy, you'd be pissed too.
Register
Apple has removed the iPhone 4 and 3Gs from its stores in Germany, almost certainly in response to Motorola's December action rather than today's patent win. But today's German court victory for Motorola is probably more important: it covers Apple's iCloud service and – by extension – any device which uses it. Apple will be …
unintended side effect
people will simply buy iPhone 4s instead of the iPhone 3G or 4. Can this be even remotely considered a victory?
Probably...
... but that's not really what this fight is about, it's more about showing your feathers and seeing who can piss the highest and in this instance Apple lost.
This fight should get more interesting now that both sides have drawn blood.
Good lad, missed the point completely!
SHAKE HANDS
And make up for goodness sake.
OK, now both sides have 'won' a round or two... Can they all just get back to making new innovative products and competing in the market instead of the courts now?
we'll still be hearing about this in 20, or even 30 years time...
People will simply give up on Apple and buy an Android handset instead. What a fantasic victory for Android.
If you live by the sword you should prepare to die by the sword. Hahahahahahahahaha!
...then you woke up.
@Colin Camper
Oh sweet Jesus, I'm an Android fanbois through and through (though previously owned original iPhone and 3G), and your comment even makes me cringe with it's stupidity.
I have to stop reading it - I'm embarrassed for you.
You do realise it only effects the online store don't you?
I have a blackberry, and an Ipad2 . the blackberry has Push emails. The Ipad, no matter how you configure the damn thing, only gets emails when you access something that uses Icloud, (Calendar, contacts etc). I don't call that push mail, are Apple letting Samsung run with the bait?
Someone doesn't know about Google Sync...
Here you go: http://support.google.com/mobile/bin/answer.py?hl=en&topic=14252&answer=138740
So...
...how do you like dem apples, Apple? ;-)
Sorry, I couldn't help myself, but at least it's no sillier than these stupid patent battles.
Cupertino has been a good deal more chatty lately
Any friend is more than no friends.
Even if it's El Reg ;o)
Nice one Germany! I believe I'm experiencing Apfelschadenfreude :D
Not over yet
Apple can appeal and they will...
correct...
Didn't take long to be overturned!
I wonder if...
Google are pulling Motorola's strings?
Google are Motorola Mobile
Not Motorola
The company split. In order to try break even. But you may be right Motorola Mobile may be dancing to Google's tune....
Boohoohooo
This couldn't have happened to a nicer company FLIP CRAPLE!!
Hopefully the German Courts will tell Craple to go forth and multiply soon enough too.
Android FTFW!
Dude, what the hell is wrong with you?
It's not football teams. You're not helping anyone. "Android FTW"? Are you 12?
I would like Apple to cease their anticompetitive legal practices. I would like to see more products competing in the smartphone arena in order to produce better value for consumers. That doesn't make some kind of Holy War or spectator sport, you knob.
" That doesn't make some kind of Holy War or spectator sport"
I'd happily kick back and watch the fireworks with a tub of popcorn.
@ mike
Mike - you and Barry Shitpeas should get together. The sheer concentration of mouth-frothing vitriol could reach critical mass, which would be amusing viewing.
They're back
According to this on all things D Apple are restoring the products
http://allthingsd.com/20120203/apple-all-ipad-and-iphone-models-will-be-back-on-sale-online-in-germany-shortly/
Mutually Assured Destruction
And people wonder where Merkin lawyers get the money to pay for Presidential candidates...s
He who lives and all that. Trouble is that they've taken a kicking from Motorola/Google and they previously took a kicking trying to give Samsung a kicking.
How long is it going to be before either the patent system gets revised or the big tech companies call some sort of truce. This stuff really isn't doing any of them any good.
For the love of god
Get all the patents in a pile;
Add kerosene;
Set the pile ablaze;
Once the smoke clears, get on without all the bullshit.
Add the lawyers
Put all the Lawyers on top of the pile first
Remember to make their families watch.......
"I'd happily kick back and watch the fireworks with a tub of popcorn."
And deckchairs. Musn't forget the deckchairs.
Ban is already suspended:
http://www.slashgear.com/apple-sales-injunction-suspended-german-ipadiphone-sales-resume-03211975/
Apple seem to have a unique interpretation of the patent system. They seem to think that because a patent exists the patent owner is forced to license it to all comers. This is not the case nor has it ever been the case. Apple's argument gets even stranger when they say that since Motorola unilaterally declared the patent to be an industry standard that somehow means Apple are forced to use it.
It seems that in this Apple's argument is that if somebody else develops something clever that Apple wants to used then they must be forced to license that patent to Apple on terms that suit Apple. Which is strange because they also seem to argue frequently that if Apple develops something clever (or indeed stupid) that anybody else wants to use (even if they had it before Apple) then Apple have the right to stop them from using it. Seems Apple thinks that patents are a one way street that runs straight to Cupertino.
I thought maybe when bonkers Jobs popped his clogs Apple would stop talking so much shite. It seems however that they are talking more shite than ever.
I suspect that it will be only a few days before Motorola gets this decision reversed.
@ Grease Monkey
They *are* entitled to think a patent is forced to be licenced, *if* that patent comes under FRAND. Also, if that patented tech becomes part of an industry 'standard' (eg 3G) - however that's defined - then yes, if they have adopt that standard to comply with 99.9% of a chosen market, they then have to pay the FRAND licence.
Where recent complexities come in is the interpretation of "fair and reasonable" rates under FRAND; Apple have been claiming it's unfair to be charged 2-3x the price of other licencee's for the same patent licence.
If this scenario was played out down the petrol station - if it was the only petrol station in town - and you were charged 2-3x the price for a litre than the next guy, you'd be pissed too.
Don't mistake my comments for fanboism btw.
Bloody hell
It's like playing poker and betting $100m
$100m is just the ante.