Could this mouse reduce your risk of developing repetitive strain injury? Creator SmartFish thinks so.
SmartFish ErgoMotion Mouse
SmartFish's ErgoMotion Mouse is essentially a standard mouse mounted on top of a tilt-and-pivot joint and a baseplate. The idea: as you steer the rodent around, your hand rolls and pitches rather …
Hang on -- the guys developed a "mouse" that encourages extension of the wrist and he calls it ergonomic? Last I knew, wrist flexion during dextrous tasks put excessive pressure on the tendons.
It also risks causing over-rotation of the wrist -- for a right-handed moving left, or a left-hander moving right, it means the palm moves beyond parallel to the desk, and parallel is the extreme of comfortable motion.
Wrist flexion pain is a sign of injury not the cause
#
Any fine motor movement becomes painful once your wrist becomes inflamed. The cause is increased pressure of fluid in your joints, which can only be alleviated with movement. Once that fluid is pushed along, pre sure is removed and the pain of wrist flexion or fine motor movement should be alleviated. Check out this recent review: http://www.nzgirl.co.nz/buy/deluxe-computer-mice/comment-page-1/#comment-2901
The problem with the a pedestal attachment is that it would make the mouse too tall. Our mouse is actually half a mouse built on a short pivot creating a pivot mouse with the equivalent height of an ordinary mouse.
It not only reduces wrist strain, it also greatly minimizes the amount of desk space needed to operate it on, since you don't need to move it around. One of those great ideas that I would think "That's so simple, I would have thought of that"... except that I didn't.
The only drawback might be a tendency to move up/down when clicking the buttons, but if the whole mechanism is stiff enough and teh buttons sensitive enough would not be a problem.
> “When using a static mouse, the hand, wrist and arm are confined to a fixed position that limits natural movements,”
Only if your rodent forces you to clamp a paw over it to drive it, as the bog-standard sized ones do. OTOH I can work a miniature rodent with my fingertips - I buy 'em for £3 by the bucketload, and if they only last 6 months WTF.
Simply looking at it, it seems obvious that the carpels will be doing *more* work than with a regular mouse! Using a wristpad, a trackball, sitting correctly at your desk, adopting a dvorak or colmacs keyboard layout that reduce finger travel ; those are solutions to RSI (which in the main part is caused mainly by bad typing posture rather than mousing).
Then I saw... as recommended by a chiropractor. Bazinga confirmed.
That lovely bunch of ch*rlatans who aren't answerable to, or registered with the general medical council, aren't usually permitted to prescribe drugs, who on occasion don't "believe" in vaccination, and don't bother with a little thing like double-blind case studies to support their claims... but somehow get away with calling themselves "Doctors" and manipulating the spines of children (and relentlessly pursuing critics with legal action).
I've heard a first hand account of a person hobbling into A&E with a broken bone in her foot. Her chiropractor had put the pain down to a spinal alignment problem and for the previous month had been giving her twice weekly spinal manipulations at fifty quid a pop. My own aunt was fleeced by these wiseguys who had no problem doing some joint cracking on the (recently broken) arthritic wrists of an 85 year old.
If their previous is anything to go by, they can shove that mouse up their 10th charkra and call it "medical science".
This mouse was not recommended by a chiropractor!
#
This mouse was invented by a Doctor of Chiropractic and designed in collaboration with the USA's number one orthopedic hospital, the Hospital for Special Surgery.
It is universally accepted that movement and postural change is the key to comfort and injury avoidance, our designs put this ergonomic principal to work on desktops.
(1) a touch pad. That was easy to fix: I won't buy or use a PC with a touch pad. If forced to use one, I plug in a mouse.
(2) the scroll wheel on a mouse. That was also easy to fix: I took the top off, filled the scroll wheel bearing with cyanoacrylate (superglue to the unwashed) and reassembled it. In case you're wondering, I needed to stop the wheel from turning so I wouldn't reflexively spin it. Everything else on the mouse still works as expected because I was careful where I put the glue. Scrolling? Thats what the arrow and PgUp/PgDn keys are for. Result: no more RSI in my left (mouse) hand and no need to buy a fancy medically approved mouse.
What does 800dpi mean for a device that pivots like a joystick? How does it perform nonlinear motion if you can't pick it up like a mouse or reposition your finger like a trackpad? With 2560x1600 being the new standard resolution, I can't imagine pointing to things with linear tracking. It would be like trying to support a telescope with your hands.
It's mouse - it moves around the desk. The tilt and pivot bit is nothing to do with control per se, only the angle at which you hold it at a given place on your desk.
"It's mouse - it moves around the desk. The tilt and pivot bit is nothing to do with control per se, only the angle at which you hold it at a given place on your desk."
Then it's too high off the desk for comfort at all.
So, an ergonomic mouse which still uses a wheel. Errr.
#
The one thing I find makes my wrists worse than anything is a scroll wheel, which this still has. Wouldn't a scroll switch or even some sort of touch sensitive scroll pad be better?
The fine article ends by saying Smartfish says it will ship to UK customers. But trying to buy direct from its Web site routes you to Amazon for payment - and Amazon.com will NOT ship to a UK address. It says so explicitly. As for Amazon.co.uk, it has no knowledge of the product.
So Smartfish may have the best of intentions, but as far as the UK is concerned this product does not yet exist. Unless you happen to be travelling to the States, or have friends there.
... the bullshit type of chiropractor? From the 'clinic' website:
"Chiropractic philosophy recognizes that the power that created the body can heal the body - as long as there is no interference. The doctor does not heal you, he is a co-facilitator with you for your body to be put in the correct environment to heal itself. The main purpose of the chiropractor is to reduce interference to your inborn, innate healing ability."
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. I seeeeeeee.
Can't wait to get my hands on this pointless overpriced wobbly mouse thing. The guy obviously knows what he's talking about. What a co-facilitator.
where is the bluetooth version! i only have a finite number of usb sockets and I have a real aversion to having stuff poking out of my laptop, spoiling its clean lines...
The trouble is most RSI that I've seen from using a mouse is from large amounts of left clicking, especially in graphics designers, and users of software like Photoshop.
I've yet to see a mouse which targets this problem well...
Based on the false notion that people should flail around with a mouse on the end of their arm.
The 'heel' of my palm hardly ever leaves the mouse mat or moves providing comfortable support for my arm without downward pressure on the mouse. Bending and straightening fingers (thumb and little mostly) gives all the up/down motion I need and pivoting at the wrist all the side to side.
I have spent thousands of hours using mouse and keyboard for CAD software and gaming. The only strain I have experienced occasionally is in the shoulder of my keyboard arm.
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Doc develops RSI-reducing rolling mouse
Could this mouse reduce your risk of developing repetitive strain injury? Creator SmartFish thinks so. SmartFish ErgoMotion Mouse SmartFish's ErgoMotion Mouse is essentially a standard mouse mounted on top of a tilt-and-pivot joint and a baseplate. The idea: as you steer the rodent around, your hand rolls and pitches rather …
This topic is closed for new posts.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:37 GMT
The Indomitable Gall
Ergonomic...? #
Hang on -- the guys developed a "mouse" that encourages extension of the wrist and he calls it ergonomic? Last I knew, wrist flexion during dextrous tasks put excessive pressure on the tendons.
It also risks causing over-rotation of the wrist -- for a right-handed moving left, or a left-hander moving right, it means the palm moves beyond parallel to the desk, and parallel is the extreme of comfortable motion.
If you want an ergonomic mouse, buy a joystick.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:25 GMT
Jatzmon
Wrist flexion pain is a sign of injury not the cause #
Any fine motor movement becomes painful once your wrist becomes inflamed. The cause is increased pressure of fluid in your joints, which can only be alleviated with movement. Once that fluid is pushed along, pre sure is removed and the pain of wrist flexion or fine motor movement should be alleviated. Check out this recent review: http://www.nzgirl.co.nz/buy/deluxe-computer-mice/comment-page-1/#comment-2901
Jack Atzmon inventor of the Smartfish Mouse
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:37 GMT
Tom 38
Sidewinder Commander #
Looks effectively the same as Microsoft's Sidewinder Commander. Wonder if it is just as ridiculously difficult to control.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:37 GMT
Anonymous Coward
This article needs a video #
To show how it moves around.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:37 GMT
Martin Lyne
Hmm #
Great idea.. but design an adaptable frame to holster existing mice (laser i'd suppose, maybe optical with a lens or something)
I'd really want to see it in action too.. my RSI crippled gamer hands might no longer be able of making these drastic rolling motions :P
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:26 GMT
Jatzmon
interesting idea #
The problem with the a pedestal attachment is that it would make the mouse too tall. Our mouse is actually half a mouse built on a short pivot creating a pivot mouse with the equivalent height of an ordinary mouse.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:38 GMT
Neil 23
You had me till "chiropractor" #
though I suppose "former" goes some way to alleviate that...
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:38 GMT
James Micallef
Cool idea #
It not only reduces wrist strain, it also greatly minimizes the amount of desk space needed to operate it on, since you don't need to move it around. One of those great ideas that I would think "That's so simple, I would have thought of that"... except that I didn't.
The only drawback might be a tendency to move up/down when clicking the buttons, but if the whole mechanism is stiff enough and teh buttons sensitive enough would not be a problem.
Well done & good luck
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:38 GMT
Edward 2
Not very useful #
Surely no-one operates a mouse with their wrist off the desk, as shown in the videos on their website. Smells like a solution in search of a problem.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:26 GMT
Jatzmon
Good point #
We only showed the wrist off the desk so you would be able to see the mouse movement better. We will address this in our next video.
Thanks for the feedback.
Jack Atzmon
CEO, Smartfish Technologies
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:39 GMT
Luther Blissett
It's not what you've got, it's how you use it #
> “When using a static mouse, the hand, wrist and arm are confined to a fixed position that limits natural movements,”
Only if your rodent forces you to clamp a paw over it to drive it, as the bog-standard sized ones do. OTOH I can work a miniature rodent with my fingertips - I buy 'em for £3 by the bucketload, and if they only last 6 months WTF.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:39 GMT
Richard Gadsden 1
The title is required, and must contain letters and/or digits. #
Smartifsh may say they will ship to a UK address, but they haven't told Amazon payments that, so you can't order one anyway.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:39 GMT
Anonymous Coward
Dr as in "Dr Nick" #
Simply looking at it, it seems obvious that the carpels will be doing *more* work than with a regular mouse! Using a wristpad, a trackball, sitting correctly at your desk, adopting a dvorak or colmacs keyboard layout that reduce finger travel ; those are solutions to RSI (which in the main part is caused mainly by bad typing posture rather than mousing).
Then I saw... as recommended by a chiropractor. Bazinga confirmed.
That lovely bunch of ch*rlatans who aren't answerable to, or registered with the general medical council, aren't usually permitted to prescribe drugs, who on occasion don't "believe" in vaccination, and don't bother with a little thing like double-blind case studies to support their claims... but somehow get away with calling themselves "Doctors" and manipulating the spines of children (and relentlessly pursuing critics with legal action).
I've heard a first hand account of a person hobbling into A&E with a broken bone in her foot. Her chiropractor had put the pain down to a spinal alignment problem and for the previous month had been giving her twice weekly spinal manipulations at fifty quid a pop. My own aunt was fleeced by these wiseguys who had no problem doing some joint cracking on the (recently broken) arthritic wrists of an 85 year old.
If their previous is anything to go by, they can shove that mouse up their 10th charkra and call it "medical science".
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:26 GMT
Jatzmon
This mouse was not recommended by a chiropractor! #
This mouse was invented by a Doctor of Chiropractic and designed in collaboration with the USA's number one orthopedic hospital, the Hospital for Special Surgery.
It is universally accepted that movement and postural change is the key to comfort and injury avoidance, our designs put this ergonomic principal to work on desktops.
Jack Atzmon
CEO, Smartfish Technologies
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:40 GMT
Ammaross Danan
Ah, but... #
But does it come with a charger stand like my MX5000?
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:41 GMT
Martin Gregorie
My personal RSI attacks... #
...have been brought on by:
(1) a touch pad. That was easy to fix: I won't buy or use a PC with a touch pad. If forced to use one, I plug in a mouse.
(2) the scroll wheel on a mouse. That was also easy to fix: I took the top off, filled the scroll wheel bearing with cyanoacrylate (superglue to the unwashed) and reassembled it. In case you're wondering, I needed to stop the wheel from turning so I wouldn't reflexively spin it. Everything else on the mouse still works as expected because I was careful where I put the glue. Scrolling? Thats what the arrow and PgUp/PgDn keys are for. Result: no more RSI in my left (mouse) hand and no need to buy a fancy medically approved mouse.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:41 GMT
flibble
Doesn't seem to ship to the UK #
If there's a UK shipping option on their website I can't see it - I get sent to amazon.com, which refuses to ship the mouse to a UK address.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:26 GMT
Jatzmon
Sorry for the inconvenience #
I will cheek our website and have this remedied immediately.
Jack Atzmon
CEO, Smartfish Technologies
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:41 GMT
Kevin McMurtrie
800dpi? #
What does 800dpi mean for a device that pivots like a joystick? How does it perform nonlinear motion if you can't pick it up like a mouse or reposition your finger like a trackpad? With 2560x1600 being the new standard resolution, I can't imagine pointing to things with linear tracking. It would be like trying to support a telescope with your hands.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:27 GMT
Jatzmon
Not a joystick #
It's a laser mouse with a pivot built solely to increase in comfort and improve ergonomics.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:41 GMT
Jon Green
So much for shipping to the UK #
"SmartFish said it will ship to UK-based buyers."
Perhaps it should tell its Amazon shipping partner about that. I get:
"We're sorry. Your items can't be shipped to your selected destination. Please select a different shipping address."
Amazon's had no trouble shipping to that address before, even from the US.
Hear that #ker-ching#? No, me neither.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:42 GMT
Clive Galway
Just a joystick? #
I don't see how this can replace a mouse.
A mouse is a relative input device - this looks more like a joystick, which is absolute.
The device *could* be relative (ie if it is sprung to the center) but then you would not be able to pick it up to recenter.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:49 GMT
Tony Smith, Editor, Reg Hardware
Re: Just a joystick? #
It's mouse - it moves around the desk. The tilt and pivot bit is nothing to do with control per se, only the angle at which you hold it at a given place on your desk.
Posted Tuesday 31st August 2010 10:22 GMT
Mage
Not a joystick? #
"It's mouse - it moves around the desk. The tilt and pivot bit is nothing to do with control per se, only the angle at which you hold it at a given place on your desk."
Then it's too high off the desk for comfort at all.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 08:26 GMT
Jatzmon
It is the same height as standard ergonomic mice #
In fact while being tilted it is even shorter than standard mice.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:42 GMT
Llanfair
Price #
Why are there two prices? Both in pound sterling?
"Available now, the ErgoMotion Mouse costs £50 (£32). SmartFish said it will ship to UK-based buyers. "
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:43 GMT
Anonymous Coward
Alternatively, for a fiver... #
...I'll sell you a mouse mat with a hump.
This post has been deleted by its author
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:44 GMT
Anonymous Coward
So, an ergonomic mouse which still uses a wheel. Errr. #
The one thing I find makes my wrists worse than anything is a scroll wheel, which this still has. Wouldn't a scroll switch or even some sort of touch sensitive scroll pad be better?
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:45 GMT
Tom Welsh
Won't ship to UK yet, AFAICS #
The fine article ends by saying Smartfish says it will ship to UK customers. But trying to buy direct from its Web site routes you to Amazon for payment - and Amazon.com will NOT ship to a UK address. It says so explicitly. As for Amazon.co.uk, it has no knowledge of the product.
So Smartfish may have the best of intentions, but as far as the UK is concerned this product does not yet exist. Unless you happen to be travelling to the States, or have friends there.
Posted Friday 3rd September 2010 15:59 GMT
Smartfish Employee
Shipping is Available #
Shipping to the U.K. is available, and we have already sent out lots of ErgoMotion Laser Mice to the U.K.
Please check our site again
http://www.getsmartfish.com/
Thanks,
Joseph
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:45 GMT
johnnytruant
best rsi reducing pointing device #
in my experience is a trackball I got for 20 quid from PC World.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:45 GMT
Geoff Mackenzie
Would this be ... #
... the bullshit type of chiropractor? From the 'clinic' website:
"Chiropractic philosophy recognizes that the power that created the body can heal the body - as long as there is no interference. The doctor does not heal you, he is a co-facilitator with you for your body to be put in the correct environment to heal itself. The main purpose of the chiropractor is to reduce interference to your inborn, innate healing ability."
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. I seeeeeeee.
Can't wait to get my hands on this pointless overpriced wobbly mouse thing. The guy obviously knows what he's talking about. What a co-facilitator.
Posted Monday 30th August 2010 07:47 GMT
Matt 13
looks funky, but.... #
where is the bluetooth version! i only have a finite number of usb sockets and I have a real aversion to having stuff poking out of my laptop, spoiling its clean lines...
Posted Tuesday 31st August 2010 10:23 GMT
Mr ChriZ
next... #
The trouble is most RSI that I've seen from using a mouse is from large amounts of left clicking, especially in graphics designers, and users of software like Photoshop.
I've yet to see a mouse which targets this problem well...
Posted Tuesday 31st August 2010 10:24 GMT
JP19
Garbage #
Based on the false notion that people should flail around with a mouse on the end of their arm.
The 'heel' of my palm hardly ever leaves the mouse mat or moves providing comfortable support for my arm without downward pressure on the mouse. Bending and straightening fingers (thumb and little mostly) gives all the up/down motion I need and pivoting at the wrist all the side to side.
I have spent thousands of hours using mouse and keyboard for CAD software and gaming. The only strain I have experienced occasionally is in the shoulder of my keyboard arm.
This topic is closed for new posts.